this post was submitted on 09 Jun 2023
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Privacy
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Whatsapp imo is better. They are both stealing your data, at least with WA you avoid plain text for third parties.
By the way, people answering Signal or Matrix: you really suck big time. Of course that's better, but it you ever have a friend outside privacy nich (or at all - your momma doesn't count-) , you would learn that's not a choice
I don't think that's true. By now, my whole family and almost all my friends are on Signal. Only a few of them are into IT to start with, let alone privacy. In my family, it was my not exactly tech-savvy grandpa that came to Signal first after I quit WhatsApp! When I quit WhatsApp most of them first went with SMS, but overtime they switched to Signal because it's easier. After a year pretty much everyone is over.
Really, all it takes is someone who's on there but not on WhatsApp (or whatever is the norm around you). Most people don't care much about privacy, and won't switch if they don't have to. But neither do they care much for another app if it benefits them (in this case, the benefit was easier chatting with me). Even less they care if that app is Telegram or Signal, especiallly if they use neither already.
And no, I didn't fight with any of my family or friend, nor did I loose contact with anyone I cared about in the process. If you handle quiting WhatsApp with a bit of tact and respect, no decent human being will hate you. Just don't be a jerk about it, but that counts for anything...
Matrix might be a bit more complex, but Signal is really not thát much trouble with "friends outside the privacy niche" other than that they have no need for it (a need which would be created by you switching to it).
When your friends and family asked about why you left Whatsapp, what was your reason? Because anytime I bring up a conversation about privacy around my friends or family they just call me paranoid and will call me paranoid for leaving Whatsapp as well and most likely just use SMS or something which is worse
@PrivateOnions @cambionn
More messenger apps need to be interoperable, with options for leading end-to-end encryption algorithms built into their interoperability protocols.
Exactly that. Privacy, and in extension of that wanting nothing to do with Meta. I think the key lies in making it a me-problem rather than them-problem. I never told them they need to stop using it nor gave them a lecture about privacy, just that I was no longer on it. And that they could reach me on Signal and SMS, or just call. If they wánt I can discuss privacy with them, but only if théy want to.
As I said, it was a slow process and most people felt it was unnecesary to install another app so they just used SMS. But over time, not being able to send images (MMS services are down with most providers here) or not having group chats made some install Signal after all. And the more did, the easier the rest followed. My grandpa was indeed the first. Not for any tech or privacy reason, but because as a typical grandfather, he cares more about chatting with his grandchild than how many apps he has. He's more the "it says I need another app, so just press install" type that ends up with tons of bloatware 🥴.
You cannot force people to care about privacy, and trying to will generally make them just get annoyed with you. They also all still use WhatsApp next to it as well. But, every chat that's moved over to Signal is improvement, and everyone who has both still increases the userbase which increases the appeal of Signal. Small steps are still improvements, and more than you get by arguing over it.
I'm also not sure if I'd count SMS worse than WhatsApp. Sure it's send plain text, but someone would need to intercept it before it get's read and used. Wheras with WhatApp, you know Meta will intercepts whatever they can. And their app is propietary + you have no proof about their encryption. For all you know, they may have a copy of your key, or process it locally before encrypting. Wouldn't be the first time Meta crosses the legal line far and only get's caught years later if ever. Their track-record isn't exactly a "they'd never do that" one. Not to forget all other data outside of yohr messages that the apps gathers that my FOSS SMS app doesn't. I don't want that installed on my phone.
I agree that mentioning them is not helpful if the question explicitly is about WhatsApp vs. Telegram. However, Signal surely is simple enough that it can be used by anyone capable of using WhatsApp. It free, encrypted and a lot more trustworthy than any F**book app ever will be.
Idk why you are being downvoted but yea unfortunately people, especially in the US where they don't even really use Whatsapp or Telegram as the default, don't care enough to download some niche app like Signal where none of their contacts but you are on it.
Can you elaborate on what kind of data [you think] they each steal?